 |
Chat Session
Conducted for Students and SEM
Practitioners with
Ongoing Access to the Resources of the
Academy of
Web Specialists
Back to Chat
Index
How to Design a Web Site that Also Happens
to be Search Engine Friendly!
February 27, 2003
Conducted by Bill Gentry
Academy of Web Specialists
Take
search engine marketing training!
Bill Gentry: I'm mostly here to answer any questions.
I don't really have a spiel to dish out, although I will give you some
resources to check out and a couple of examples to look at.
Standup
Comedian: What are your thoughts on the micro-sites?
Bill
Gentry: Used to do them a couple of years ago. For rankings and traffic
purposes I was successful at deploying them...
Bill Gentry: We
used them to funnel traffic through them. I don't remember how well that
worked, but the rankings and traffic to the sites were good. And these were
sites with online gambling related keywords.
Standup Comedian:
Which do you think are better 1 page micro's or 4 or 5 page mini's?
Bill Gentry: Nowadays, I probably wouldn't use them. I would
rather put the relevant information on site.
Bill Gentry: Our
"mini sites" were a minimum of 4-5 pages, sometimes as many as 10 pages
depending upon the topic and the amount of content we could muster up.
Bill Gentry: If you're going to use them, then I suggest several pages
rather than one.
Standup Comedian: If they were to drive
traffic and create link popularity to a central site that has some real hard
competition. I have noticed that Campbell and Martelli are using long single
pages.
Bill Gentry: Oh, one other thing about some of those
mini sites... I have derived a fair amount of affiliate income from them, in
addition to the flow through traffic.
Bill Gentry: Let's put it
this way: You are going to find that every SEO professional has an opinion
about what works best based on his or her experiences.
Bill Gentry:
For me, I have had success with 4-5 page mini sites, but I have never
deployed single page sites whereas others have done just the opposite and had
success.
Bill Gentry: I have had a lot of success working with
online gaming sites, and terrible success with real estate sites, yet others
may have the opposite experiences.
Bill Gentry: So, everyone
has good advice to give, but you also need to beware of the negative advice
they give, because others will have good experiences under the same or similar
conditions.
Martin M: It's funny you mentioned that you did not
have success with RE sites...I am about to suggest the strategy for a group of
agents.
Webman: I am trying the strategy with a group of
mortgage sites.
Bill Gentry: Like I said, everyone will have
different success stories. Perhaps my lack of good results with RE sites were
because of some of the constraints and bad content supplied to me by the client
Bill Gentry: So, now I would like to get back on topic.
Designing SE Friendly Web Sites.
Burgwald: How would I set a
series of mini sites with one server or multi domain names?
Burgwald: with one server.
Webman: I'd say the latter.
Bill Gentry: Not sure I understand the question completely.
When I worked at The Selling Source, we deployed hundreds of mini sites, all
served from the same server with different domain names. We linked them
together where doing so was logical...
Bill Gentry: All of the
online gaming related sites were linked together, but we didn't link them to
the cash advance sites.
Martin M: So all of the sites had the
same IP address?
Bill Gentry: Most of them.
Standup
Comedian: Mine I'll have anonymous domain names, all on different hosts in
different states.
Burgwald: Does it make any difference for
type ie .com .us, etc?
Bill Gentry: Occasionally I would have
our server admin set me up a couple of them with unique IPs, but it was
troublesome for him to them all, when you are talking hundreds of domains.
Burgwald: Explain.
Bill Gentry: We used .com
and .net, so I would say that it probably doesn't matter, except that when
people try to guess the domain name and type it directly into their browser
they are going to try .com first...
Bill Gentry: So if you are
trying to brand a site, I suggest using .com tlds.
Bill Gentry:
What do you mean? Explain.
Burgwald: Troublesome for the
IP.
Webman: I think he meant elaborate, which you just did.
Bill Gentry: When you are setting up domains with a shared IP,
basically all you have to do is create the domain space on the server...
Burgwald: How?
Bill Gentry: When you are
creating unique IPs for each domain there are several additional steps that
have to be taken to set up the unique IP address, plus you have to get those
IPs from your hosting company before you can set them up on your server...
Burgwald: What are the steps?
Bill Gentry: If
you are asking me for a step by step procedure on how to set up domains on a
server, I cannot answer your question. It has been more than a year since I
have set up domains on a server myself. Plus it is way beyond the scope of the
topic of this chat session: Designing SE Friendly Sites. So I would really like
to get back on topic.
Standup Comedian: Do you find using CSS
with only divisions and no tables to be advantageous?
Bill Gentry:
There is enormous power in CSS if you take a little time to learn how to
use it to manipulate page elements.
Bill Gentry: There are
situations where I will use tables in conjunction with CSS. See SEO Jobs:
www.seojobs.com/index.php.
Bill Gentry: It is done using
tables, and in some areas nested tables. But all of the content (and the
navigation buttons) make heavy use of CSS.
Standup Comedian: I
think it was your code I saw where you Z layered divisions to place keyword
rich text higher than the images. Is that a good strategy?
Bill
Gentry: On the other hand, my cousin's site, Denise Bruchman:
www.denisebruchman.com/photos/index.php, which I am currently developing, uses
CSS to determine placement of page elements as well as style.
Bill
Gentry: Using z-orders won't place your keywords higher on the page.
Z-orders are used for depth... putting layers (containers) on top of each
other.
Martin M: I was going to ask if it is best to stay away
from using frames and just use tables? I still have more to learn about CSS.
Are you using CSS for rollovers at SEOJobs.com? I thought nested tables were
not good to use.
Bill Gentry: What I think you mean is that I
may have an image at the top of a page, but looking at the underlying code
shows it at the bottom. That's a function of absolute positioning and I can
change the order of appearance in a browser by using absolute positioning.
Bill Gentry: If you want your site spidered, then stay away
from frames. Most search engines will not follow the links to framed pages from
the framset page. They use "src=" rather than "href=".
Bill Gentry:
The navigation buttons at SEOJobs.com are text links with CSS applied to
them to make them look like buttons.
Bill Gentry: Regarding
nested tables... I think most search engines (at least those major ones that
have been around a while now) are smart enough to know what is content and what
is HTML...
Bill Gentry: So it is my opinion that bloated code
won't necessarily penalize you, but you should still try to make your code as
streamlined as possible.
Pata: I check my log files all the
time (7 sites) and IE 4 is still very popular. Do these CSS strategies render
correctly in 4.0 browsers?
Bill Gentry: It depends... I read a
really great book recently on CSS: "Designing CSS Web Pages" by Christopher
Schmitt.
Bill Gentry: No, it's not a CSS definition book. It's
a book on tapping the power of CSS and creating great sites.
Pata:
Does this book list CSS features and their browser introduction?
Bill Gentry: In the book he shows you how to build a page that will look
great in modern browsers, but still work just fine in older non-CSS browsers.
Standup Comedian: Would the higher numbered the z-layer
regardless of actual placement in the physical code be crawled by the spider
before the lower numbered division?
Bill Gentry: I am not sure
how a spider actually crawls a page. My guess is that they read the source code
from top to bottom.
Bill Gentry: So using absolute positioning
you can push your content to the top of the source code without affecting the
way modern browsers render the page.
Bill Gentry: However, if
you look closely at Google's descriptions, you'll notice that the descriptions
are actually snippets of content from various places on a page...
Bill Gentry: So even pushing content to the top of the source code
doesn't matter much for Google.
Standup Comedian: Which do you
prefer to use for font-size? pt, em, or px?
Bill Gentry: I
prefer pt, because I can control the output somewhat. I have found that 9pt
Verdana renders almost identically in Netscape and IE which is a plus for cross
browser design...
Bill Gentry: And Verdana is not so small at
that point size as to be unreadable at high screen resolutions.
Webman: Isn't 9pt a little small?
Bill Gentry: Not
Verdana font. Other fonts, yes, 9 pt would be way too small. If I use Arial,
I'll bump it up to 12 point or larger, or go with ems.
Standup
Comedian: Regarding naming do you use id= or class= ?
Bill
Gentry: If you want to apply behavior scripting then you have to use ID. To
apply a style, you have to use CLASS.
Bill Gentry: If you want
to apply behavior scripting to a style, you have to use both.
Bill
Gentry: We're starting to run short of time, so before everyone runs off, I
want to get one more thing in real quickly.
Bill Gentry: Learn
copywriting. It's essential in attracting and keeping visitors as well as good
rankings.
Bill Gentry: Another book that's a big help:
"Networds" by Nick Usborne.
Shermanhu: GREAT BOOK! Amazing
writer - personal vibe and voice. He also moderates a newsletter list on
copywriting at www.adventive.com and his "excess voice" ezine from his site is
also very good - www.nickusborne.com.
Bill Gentry: Also, "The
Step by Step Copywriting Course" by Karon Thackston. It's available online and
not expensive.
Shermanhu: Also another great ebook.
Bill Gentry:
www.copywritingcourse.com>http://www.copywritingcourse.com
Bill Gentry: Those two books should have you writing better copy in a
couple of weeks.
Shermanhu: True, true.
Bill
Gentry: I will also take questions past this chat session at
bill
Shermanhu: Thanks bill for your
nuggets of wisdom!
Bill Gentry: No problem.
Burke:
What is the difference in content etc. between the courses offered from ACW
and the workshops? If any?
Martin M: Thank you bill, I just
took the Orlando SEO Workshop and Robin & John had lots of great things to
say about you! Thanks again
Bill Gentry: Not sure. I haven't
attended the workshops. But the big difference is that you have live
instruction, you can ask questions and get live answers, and you get one on one
time with Robin and John during the workshops.
Bill Gentry:
I'll be popping in on the workshop in May here in Vegas.
Shermanhu: Plus Michael Campbell, Brent Winters, Dave Berry, plus others
Martin M: Excellent workshop!!! Can't say enough great things
about it! And Robin & John are just the best teachers!
Bill
Gentry: Yes, they have quite an entourage traveling with them now.
Standup Comedian: Oh good I am going so I will look forward to meeting
you!
Shermanhu: Yes - either in person or via conferencing.
Bill Gentry: Yes, I need to get some photos for the SEW site!
Shermanhu: Plus you get so much in bonuses! Including a 6
months free hosting acct with combustion hosting.
Shermanhu:
Michael's ebooks, and discounts on software, etc.
Martin M:
I highly recommend the workshop. Robin, John and all of their guests are
tremendously generous and very easy to understand.
Bill Gentry:
And a discount on web design from me if you don't have the time,
inclination or creativity to design your own web site!
Standup
Comedian: You mean I won't have to steal your code anymore?
Shermanhu: Great shameless self promotion -grin-
Bill
Gentry: Yeah, it was, but I couldn't help it.
Bill Gentry:
We'll everyone, we're out of time. If you have any questions that didn't
get answered you can e-mail them to me at bill
Back to Chat
Index
Enroll in a Search
Engine Marketing Training Program
|